Winchesters New 350 Legend....
357 Magnum Maximum?
Rimless 357 max off of the 223. Not suprised, Starline has 223/556 basic brass.
They will say it's new, I saw one done in about 1988 on an XP.
Some still here may recall when we tried to get them to make a 223 basic years ago.
G whiz, it's a Contender or a G2, never was G1!
I did a batch of 357/223 on xp100 in 2018
I may need one done in 2019.
Hmmm, I may have my next AR build IF it will feed well.
It's not a break, it's a brake, unless it's a break, then it's broke ;-)
There is a company in one of the strait wall states making ar barrels in 357/223
Would be a good choice for a shooter wanting a larger caliber and has an XP with a 223 bolt face donor.
They will say it is new because it is .1" longer than .357 Rem Max, sort of like the 300 Whisper vs 300 Blackout thing.
I'm more interested in the new 35 caliber bullets that the bullet makers will come out for it. A lighter pointed bullet for the 357 max and mag or even the 35 rem would be great.
When these brass and bullets show on the market I suggest buying a lifetime supply if you want to use them.
Reading between the lines Winchester has come out with this to fill the notch for the Shotgun Only states that have allowed straight wall calibers with shorter cases length regulations. This should be able to run in an AR platform with proper mags. Should make a good 200 yard or so deer getter.
Really no need to worry about that unless you just want to have proper head stamped brass because I don't think the 223 is going away anytime soon, you can just use it like others have used it to make 300 Whisper/Blackout brass.
Life Member NRA
Will it be too much for the contender?
It's based on a 223 case. Should be fine in a Contender and I could see maybe doing one although I'd probably just stick with a 357 Max for the easier handling of a rimmed case. I'd be more interested in throwing one on something like a Howa mini or CZ 527.
It looks like CMMG is the only company making an AR for it. If I can use regular AR magazines I’ll probably get an upper. If I need special magazines then I’ll pass.
ETA: According to Winchester the 350 Legend is getting 2100 fps. I’ve seen 357 Maximum loads that were beating that by 400 fps. I don’t have a Max rifle to test but I’m sure those that do can correct me.This message has been edited. Last edited by: xrayoneone,
looks like I can add to my TCU collection, have been using StarLine basic brass for other stuff already makes way better cases nice and long, did a similar 338 2 years ago
I'd guess most of that velocity difference is due to the pressures they're being run at. Factory ammo held low to be safe in AR's isn't the same as hot handloads. They're similar sized cases, comparing them at the same pressures the velocities would be pretty close to each other
With my 357/223 xp100 13” I was doing the same as my 14” max contender
EDITED: I just noticed the 2100 fps is for the 180 gr load. The 150 gr load is listed at 2350 fps.This message has been edited. Last edited by: xrayoneone,
Many are saying here and on other forums they or someone had made similar years ago. Don't be upset, by Winchester producing it as a standard cartridge it shows you were doing right.
Right, and I say so what? Rifle makers have been doing this for centuries. Here are just a few chamberings not originally developed for commercial rifles but later made in them:
Apparently in today’s world folks can get offended by almost anything....
I'm reading now that the initial commentary of it essentially being a 358/223 wasn't correct. It's actually a 9mm/355 bore on a proprietary case with a 223 case head.
If you have a FB account, go to the Winchester page at 2pm CST. They will be doing a live Q&A session today concerning this 350 L.
It uses .357" bullets. It is basically a 223 case straight walled. Starline has offered the "223 basic" brass for a couple months now. According to what I've read, you cannot use 223 rem/5.56 cases to make it though. Don't remember why but that was pointed out in the article.
Saami info https://www.nssf.org/saami-ann...50-legend-cartridge/
More info http://bit.ly/350LegendFAQ
The 350 case is wider at the base than the 223. It actually has some taper which will help it feed from a box magazine. Correct, it cannot be made from 223 basic brass. I made some 357/223 dummy cases and gave up on the idea due to the shape of the cartridge. Win took the idea to the next level.
It's not a break, it's a brake, unless it's a break, then it's broke ;-)
this may have been done, but i got this from an excellent gunsmith(from his website).....i don't know if i'm allowed to put his website on here, moderators can you please tell me to do it or not?
i'll put his quote tho....
My sincerest apologies for the deletion of all the posts that were already here...
Reason being is that I just spent a couple of hours on the phone with guys from Winchester, and with all of the new things that I have learned today, misinformation was given, and some to the point that is would open up liabilities that I would not want to be responsible for...
So, with information that is now fact, and straight from the company who designed and developed the new 350 Legend cartridge, let's try this again...
Key Features of the 350 Legend Cartridge, as listed by Winchester -
More ENERGY than 30-30 Win, 300 Blackout and 223 Remington...
World’s fastest straight-walled cartridge...
Approximately 20% LESS RECOIL than the 243 Winchester...
20% more PENETRATION...
LESS RECOIL than the 450 Bushmaster...
Effective deer hunting ranges up to 250 yards, plus it delivers more energy than the 5.56mm, 300 Blackout or 30-30 Winchester...
This is a new case design and is NOT made from straight walled 223 Remington brass...
Compliant in states that allow straight wall cartridges for deer hunting...
2019 - 350 Legend Ammunition Offerings From Winchester:
350 Deer Season XP® 150 grain Extreme Point / 2,325 fps...
350 Super X® 180 grain Power-Point / 2,100 fps...
350 Hog Special 180 grain Power-Point / 2,100 fps...
350 USA White Box 145 grain FMJ Flat Nose / 2,350 fps...
350 Power Max Bonded® 160 grain Bonded JHP / 2,225 fps...
350 Super Suppressed™ 265 grain Open Tip / 1,060 fps...
The 350 Legend is rated at a s.a.a.m.i. maximum average pressure of 55,000 psi...
BORE/GROOVE is .346/.355........... Now knowing this information, I would NOT use .358 diameter bullets in a factory chambered rifle! Reason being is that the factory chamber is cut with a .357 diameter throat, then it tapers down to .355 (which is 9mm)...
Factory barrel's are 9mm and are NOT .357 or .358, but with the throating that Winchester is using, and using bullets of softer construction, those bullets can and do squeeze down in diameter to pass through the bore without issue!
New rifles or barrels offered through me, will have the correct 9mm bore and groove diameter and will be throated specifically for. 357 diameter bullets...
I should be able to tweak a few dimensions on the reamer to make it BETTER, since it is now s.a.a.m.i. spec'd reamer and the final dimensions have already been made...
Again, my apologies for the deletion of the other posts. Any questions, I will take them straight to the source and make sure that any and all answers are correct before posting..."
“All that was great in the past was ridiculed, condemned, combated, suppressed — only to emerge all the more powerfully, all the more triumphantly from the struggle.”
― Nikola Tesla
That should fix the 357/223 reloading issues.
Also fix the feeding issues
Only problem I see is they must be making proprietary bullets since 9mm stops at 147 ish.
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