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Trail Boss and 17FB in a XP Login/Join 



posted
Hi,

Is anyone using Trail Boss in a 17 Fireball in a rear grip XP or other hunting short barrelled gun.
I am interested in what twist rates you are using to get a well stabilised 20 or 25 grain VMAX bullet which shoots and groups well at low velocities of around 2000 to 2200 FPS.

Using the Berger twist rate calculator, it says it is totally unstable. My 17FB 1 in 9 rifle shoots well with 20grn normal loads but doesn't group to well with TB loads and Berger says use a 1 in 7 for kind of load.

So looking to build a rear grip if I can find a small bolt XP or wondered about picking up a small bolt 17REM 222 or 223 REM 700 action and have a 16 to 18" barrel screwed on with a sound moderator.

That brings me to the next question will a REM 700 action drop into a secondhand rear grip XP100R stock with a little work. Being a South Paw the thumb rest would need to be removed anyway.

G
 
Posts: 117 | Location: UK | Registered: February 01, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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A 700 won't fit an xp100r stock. The SA700 is quite a bit longer. So if you left the rear hole location the same you'd have to move the slot for the recoil lug forward, drill a new hole for the front action screw, and mill out the hole for the mag box. Guess I shouldn't say it won't work, but that its gonna be more than a little work.

I haven't played with TB in a 17FB but I have played with it in a 17 Ackley hornet. I used it in two different ones. One is an 8.5t mcgowen xp-100 with a 14" barrel. The other is a browning abolt with a 22" 9t lilja. I shot 20's in the lilja and it shot well. If I remember correctly I was right at 2100fps. In the XP I shot 25gr vmax. It would stick them in one hole at 50 yards. Which is really what I wanted. Planned use was for tree squirrels. At 100 the bullets were unstable. You might need 20gr HP bullets. Not having the twist would make a big difference for stability.

Aaron
 
Posts: 2756 | Location: AK | Registered: March 13, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post


0716223



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The XP-100R's are based on the Rem model 7 action. If you can find one of those it should drop right in.

Rick
 
Posts: 3551 | Location: Mesa, Arizona | Registered: January 18, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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first xp's were on 600 series rem actions
 
Posts: 531 | Location: WI | Registered: August 04, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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Many thanks for the response and information on the actions, I now need to settle on a twist rate for a 17cal 20grn and 25grn VMAX bullet for velocity of around 2000 to 2200 fps.

My 1 in 9" rifle does not shoot to well at this low velocity and the Berger program suggests a 1 in 7" for the Vmax's.

Whats is the general thought on the general accuracy at the lower velocities with the VMAX bullets and the different twist rates. To help me decide what would the best twist rate barrel for the project.
G
 
Posts: 117 | Location: UK | Registered: February 01, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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There are a few companies that offer 6.5" twists. If you will only ever shoot it at the low speeds then you probably should look at those. IF you ever plan on shooting bullets faster then I'd get a 9. The 6.5t can and will puff bullets mid flight at full speed. Kinda cool the first time, but sucks after that.

Aaron
 
Posts: 2756 | Location: AK | Registered: March 13, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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Why do you want to shoot it so slow?

Aaron
 
Posts: 2756 | Location: AK | Registered: March 13, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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quote:
Why do you want to shoot it so slow?

Aaron


Usual problem, the Estate owners want a quieter report, less wildlife disturbance even though using a large sound moderator. so only going to use these kind of loads with this gun.

Squirrels mainly. National push on reducing the numbers of your none native grey squirrel which has nearly killed off most of are Red squirrels through the Squirrel Pox which the Greys carry. The British Reds have no resistance to the Pox and die in about 5 days.

Also I find everything settles down much quick as well with a quieter report.

There is a strange thing as well with your Greys, they seem to do terrific damage to young trees which the reds don't. The forestry people hate the Greys, I have seen many trees with the tops ringed and died out.

Been there, done it before chased velocity for years, but the low velocity loads are much better.
 
Posts: 117 | Location: UK | Registered: February 01, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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Have you considered a smaller case then? Or a larger bore? If you're gonna stick with the 17 then a smaller case like a 17 squirrel, mink, or ackley hornet would be a better fit. Could also do one on the TCM case. Would end up with a 17 shrew like case.

Aaron
 
Posts: 2756 | Location: AK | Registered: March 13, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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Currently using a 22-250AI with a fast twist 18" barrel in a rear grip XP with 50grn Ballistic tips @ 2150fps and it groups like a dream using Trail Boss.

Then I noticed my 17FB rifle with Trail Boss is so much quieter. The chances of finding a 223 xp100r in the UK are very slim to re-barrel, so I was wondering about getting a 17REM, 222 etc with a 700 action and using a Choate varmint stock to create an XP look a like.
Just a thought if one finds an XP100r in any calibre could one just change the bolt to a 223 and re-barrel.

Did think about the smaller wild cat rounds but did not want to get into the all the associated feeding problems.
 
Posts: 117 | Location: UK | Registered: February 01, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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So you want it to feed from a mag box? I've never tried it but I hear that there can be issues with feeding 17 fireball cases in 700's that weren't originally built for them. Apparently the feed ramp is different. Like I said, I haven't tried it though. My dad is gonna try it sometime. He's got the parts but who knows when he'll get around to building it.

Since it sounds like you're gonna only use it as a low velocity rig I'd get a 6.5t barrel from Lilja or pacnor. Should easily stabilize those bullets at the low speed.

Aaron
 
Posts: 2756 | Location: AK | Registered: March 13, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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